‘I have learnt to stay away from office’

Stephen R Covey’s ‘The 7 Habits of Highly Effective People’ has been a
bestseller for nearly 20-odd years since it was first published in 1989. The success, says Covey, “is because it has universal, timeless principles in it, that apply in
any country, in any culture, throughout the world.” In an interview with DNA, Covey spoke about how he applies his principles in his own life, why he avoids email, why most executives spend their time doing things which are urgent but not so important, and how one can get more out of life. Excerpts:

With the advent of technology, there are so many distractions in our work lives. How do you really put First Things First (the title of one of his best-sellers)?
That is one of the key questions. There are so many distractions and so many things that are urgent, but they are not really important. Research shows that most executives spend half their time doing things that are urgent but not important. And they end up neglecting their families, their personal life. Their community service suffers and their organisations are not as productive.

How do you separate the urgent from the important? Any tips?
I stay away from email and from a lot of the new technology and delegate that to my staff.

You stay away from email?
I have an email source. But it comes from my assistant. And she knows how to distinguish what is important from what is just urgent and not important. I have learnt to stay away from office. I don’t go to meetings. Occasionally, I will (go to office) if it is a strategic meeting because I am the co-chairman of our company. I mostly work out of my home and not at an office because you are pressed there by urgencies and not by important things. I also get up early and I sharpen the saw every morning, getting onto a stationary bike, by swimming and doing some yoga and strength exercises — and that takes me an hour. And I plan my day during that hour as well. I win my victories privately.

How do you spend your day normally?
Well, I try to practise what I teach. So I spend my day working on six book projects — books that I am working on right now. One of them is how to overcome crime. I am presenting this to the president of Mexico. We have cities all over the world that have reduced crime by 80-90%. Another one deals with how universities can transform communities. Another one deals with how attorneys can learn to be peace-makers instead of fighters and adversaries.

Or ambulance chasers?
Right. Another one is on how to get character education into schools and what impact that has on academic performance. And the results are so dramatic and so measurable that it is astounding for people and for educators to see it happen. Another deals with how to live life in crescendo — meaning the most important work you will ever do is always ahead of you, so that you are continuously trying to make a contribution and make a difference. So that you never retire. You may retire from your job but not from meaningful work. Another one is a textbook for college students.

How do you manage to write six books at the same time?
I have research teams on each project and we study before and after what happens in the place where it was implemented, and what process went through and what were the results. And then I teach it. And as I teach, I walk around the audience and interact a great deal. So I understand what their minds are at, what they are thinking about, what their concerns and challenges are. This way the material becomes very relevant, and I know it works before I even publish the book. And I am sent books all the time for endorsement purposes and I can tell within 15 minutes whether it will sell or not. And usually most of them won’t sell because they are in the mind of the writer, not in the mind of the reader.

What kind of food do you eat?
Mostly fruits, vegetables and wheat. Very little meat.

What time do you get up and what time do you turn in for the night?
I usually get up at around 6.30 am and I turn in at around midnight.

So you manage with just five or six hours of sleep?
Yeah. That just shows you are really following your own advice very closely.
Well, I am turned on by my mission. I have a real sense of calling and mission towards what I am doing and the opportunity to influence different countries and to influence these leaders.

Most people are confused about what to do with their lives. They just trudge along and take what comes along their way. How do we discover the inner purpose of our lives?

You have to ask the question: What is it that you love doing and that you do well, and that serves a human need and that you feel called to do almost by your conscience. When those four things overlap — talent, passion, conscience and need —then people would have found their voice. But most people are never asked those questions. They are more told (what to do). They are given a job description.

How did you come up with the number seven for The Seven Habits of Highly
Effective People? Why not eight or five?
There was no particular reason. It just worked out that way. The first three habits represented the personal, the next three habits represented relationships with others.

The seventh one, sharpen the saw (improving on one’s strengths), deals with four parts of our nature: our body, our mind, our heart and our spirit. And I find that when people personally continue to sharpen the saw, it helps all the other six habits.

How does an individual incorporate the seven habits in daily life?
Most people have never found their voice. Seriously they are in jobs where they just go through the motions. They have not moved to complementary teams where people’s voices or strengths are made productive and weaknesses are made irrelevant through the strengths of other people. And unless they get a new mindset in moving towards this kind of open, genuine communication, they won’t find their voice. Consequently, they won’t do quality work which they otherwise could. And they don’t like it. In most cases most of the people at the lower ends of organisations don’t even know what the strategic goals are. And they don’t even care. Helping a person find his or her voice takes more than just interpersonal skills. It takes formalisation of principles inside the structure, systems and organisations. Otherwise, it’s not going to be durable. It will not endure.

Where did you get the inspiration to write The Seven Habits...?
It came from 20 years of research and consulting with organisations. The key insight was the separation between the private victory, which represents first three habits, and the public victory, which represents the next three habits.

You advise people to be proactive but governments are always reactive. Is there a disconnect between organisations and the advice?
There is a disconnect. And that’s true with governments and with organisations that do not have competition in the marketplace. But those who are proactive can make great things happen, can anticipate problems, can get into a preventive mindset rather than just reacting to problems as they come up. Successful people are opportunity-minded and not problem-minded.

Can you name any companies that have moved successfully to the knowledge age?
I was just with Toyota over in Japan, and they are so far ahead of Ford and General Motors and Chrysler, who are still buried in the Industrial Age. Toyota is moving so much more rapidly towards the Knowledge-Worker Age. They have more of a complementary team where strengths are made productive and weaknesses are made irrelevant through the strengths of other people. Less top-down, less authoritarian, more empowerment and more synergy, where the whole is greater than the sum of the parts.

And that is why Toyota is succeeding all around the world.

We have seen several US financial services firms go under. Is this because of their failure to observe these habits that has caused this?
Definitely. And it also comes from people not living by principles. Now the trust has gone down so low, that people have very little confidence in them. So they need to focus a great deal on how to inspire trust and to do that you have to live by principles and have the organisation live by principles. Once you have people inspired and trust is very high, then you can involve them in coming up with a common vision and mission and value system. Then they align all the structures and systems based on principles.

Then you help people find their voice. Every person has the opportunity to do what he or she loves doing and, if they do it well, that serves the needs of the organisation. So we will focus on those four imperatives of leadership: inspire trust, verify purpose, align systems and unleash talent.

What kind of leaders have really internalised the habits you have talked about? Look at Mahatma Gandhi. He never held a position and was the leader of the largest democracy in the world. I just had a great personal visit with Nelson Mandela down in South Africa. He got his moral authority in prison. And then (Frederik Willem) de Klerk opened the path for him to be released and become the first president of the new South Africa. Leadership is moral authority whereas management is formal authority that is conferred from the top. But leadership is earned from below, based on high trust and getting people emotionally connected with the strategic goals because they were involved and they understand them and they emotionally connect to them.

Do you have a personal hero, who would embody these things?
Gandhi

What about Barack Obama or John McCain, the political leaders who fought the presidential election in the US?
I don’t have the same level of confidence in the cast that had been put up to the American public today. But I do believe that whoever it is, they have to have a more synergistic approach towards their relations with other people and other nations. I have trained over 35 heads of states. I have trained their cabinets, their advisors, and their legislatures and also their supreme courts and judiciary. So I see what builds trust and what destroys trust. When trust is high, speed goes up tremendously, productivity grows up. When trust is low, speed and productivity go down.

What are your impressions about India?
Well. One thing is that there are so many different interests that it is difficult to make changes. And there is a lot of heavy tradition and a lot of industrial age thinking going on from my experience.

Any plans to come to India?
I am coming to India in the end of January 2009. Visiting five cities and then come back.

Any one message that you would like to give to our readers?
I would say for your body: assume you would have had a heart attack. Now eat and exercise accordingly. For your mind: assume that the half life of your profession is only two years, so prepare accordingly. For your heart: assume that everything is shared by another person; they can overhear and now speak accordingly. For your spirit: assume you are going to have a one-on-one visit with your creator every three months. Now live accordingly.

r_jagannathan@dnaindia.net
k_vivek@dnaindia.net